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How long have we got? It is nearly lunch time, so I will try to be brief. Amendment 76 would place on the Scottish ministers the burden of ensuring that the information that applicants disclose is accurate. Section 9 makes it explicit that ministers must check that an application has been received, that the fee has been paid and that the applicant can demonstrate that they can possess and use fireworks safely. However, the section does not overtly mandate ministers to verify the accuracy or veracity of information that is provided in an application. If the section says that, the provision is hidden away—I cannot find it. The problem with that approach is that it places the legal onus on the applicant alone to provide truthful information—for example, about convictions, which we have discussed.

Amendment 76 would make it clear that, when ministers administer the scheme, the licence scheme operator would—before a licence was issued—be the ultimate check and balance for the information that had been given. The committee’s stage 1 report expressed concern about technical and legal issues that might arise from data sharing between agencies in relation to information that is provided. It is still entirely unclear how the licence scheme operator will ensure that true data sharing arrangements are in place. The easier and more technically competent that is, the easier it will be for ministers to stomach my amendment.

On the legal point, I argue that, before issuing a licence under a scheme that they have created and which they operate, ministers have a duty to check the veracity of information that is provided. That is a prerequisite to a licence being issued to someone who can subsequently purchase, possess and use fireworks. That covers amendment 76.

I hope that amendment 78 will be a talking point. It requires purchasing history to be recorded. The first question is why we need that. I am concerned that, as the bill stands, there is nothing to prevent a licence holder from making multiple purchases to the maximum allowed volume of fireworks per purchase not just on one day or in one place but on multiple days or in multiple places. Theoretically, a white van man could go from store to store and go online and, in effect, purchase a stockpile.

I know that it is not practical and perhaps not even possible to mandate retailers to record and share purchase history data. That would be ideal, but I know that the minister will confirm that we cannot do that. The next question is how we solve that problem and address the potential behaviour that I outlined.

We can ensure that the licence holder uploads or records purchase data on their licence if it is technically feasible to do so. Perhaps another iteration of amendment 78 could or should say that. A fairly insubstantial technical solution could monitor purchase history, perhaps even anonymously, and highlight red flags to authorities. In a scenario in which a white van man seller uses his perfectly legal licence to make repeated and multiple purchases across different venues, modes or geographies, it would become apparent that illegal activity might be taking place.

If we are going to use a new fit-for-purpose licensing scheme, let us get it right from the start and make it a scheme that actively helps the police, trading standards authorities and ministers to not only track but flag problematic behaviour before it becomes an issue. If the Government does not think that that is a good idea or that amendment 78 is the right way to do it, I am open to alternative means. However, at the moment, it would be perfectly possible for someone to use their licence to stockpile and illegally sell or misuse fireworks. The licence itself will not stop people who abuse the system—that will happen anyway—but the use of the data, which is big data, will powerfully prevent abuse before it happens. Amendment 78 might be one way of doing that.

I move amendment 76.

Amendment 67 proposes that the legal age for the purchase of fireworks be raised from 18 to 21. There are a number of reasons for my mooting that idea to the committee and the minister. It is clear to anyone who lives in a community that has been blighted by the misuse of fireworks and the antisocial behaviour that stems from it that the 16 to 21-year-old cohort often makes up the largest proportion of those who misuse fireworks.

We know that the average age of perpetrators of fireworks-related offences is around 22, although that is subject to further analysis. It has not been easy to uncover that data. If we had the benefit of more time, we could do more work on that. Further analysis of the information would be helpful if we had the time to get it. However, the point is that there is a clear pattern of behaviour from those aged 18 to 21 in the communities where the misuse of fireworks is a problem. Furthermore, there is already an acceptance in sentencing guidelines that young offenders up to the age of 25 are treated somewhat differently in the eyes of the law, so the law already has some precedent of acknowledging that young offenders are dealt with differently, whatever people’s views are on that.

Police Scotland’s submission to the committee at stage 1 said:

“availability is a concern when considered in conjunction with the profile of many football ‘ultra’ groups, which often attract teenage boys”.

That shows that younger groups are a big concern for the police, which is reinforced by Police Scotland’s comment that

“Protecting children and young people from harm is of paramount importance and in order to do this, potential supply chains to young people must be interrupted.”

One way to control the supply chain is to raise the legal age of purchase. On the face of it, 21 may seem high in relation to other pieces of legislation, but it is worth noting that other Governments are actively considering raising certain ages. For example, raising the legal age of smoking to 21 has been mooted. There is general consensus—academic and otherwise—that cultural and societal shifts can happen when minimum ages are increased. Cigarettes, although harmful, are not dangerous weapons, but fireworks can be.

I lodged amendment 67 to see what members think of the proposal to raise the minimum age for the purchase of fireworks. It is worth noting that the proposal comes from the fireworks industry and is in its action plan for Government on cracking down on fireworks misuse. Somewhat to my surprise, the industry, which has a vested interest in selling as many products to as wide a cohort of people as it can, recognises the problem of antisocial behaviour among the younger cohort of society. The industry accepts that, and it proposes that the legal age of purchase should be raised to 21. It is unclear what the Government’s position on that is, but I am sure that we are about to find out.

Amendment 68 relates to a point that came up briefly earlier in the debate about who may hold a licence and the nature of the licensing scheme. I hope that what I am trying to achieve is helpful to the Government. If amendment 68 does not do it, perhaps we can revisit the matter.

Amendment 68 seeks to allow a person to apply for a fireworks licence on behalf of a community group that wishes to put on a display, which we accept may be a proportionate and sensible way of conducting fireworks displays, or to allow a group to apply for a licence. That scenario would allow the group to apply collectively for a licence or to appoint a named person to acquire a licence on behalf of the group for a specific event.

That approach would have a number of benefits. The most obvious one is that it would prevent the possibility of fireworks being stockpiled by people who had purchased them individually to contribute to a community-led display. In essence, such a display would be created by many individuals who would each have a licence. In that case, there would be no real control over the quantity of fireworks that were purchased or the scale of the display. That could result in fairly large-scale displays being put on during the prescribed period.

Equally, community groups have expressed concerns that licensing might be time consuming and expensive for small community groups if it has to be done on the basis of individual licences. The obvious solution to that problem would in fact be stockpiling. As would be allowed under the bill, individuals could purchase up to the maximum volume allowed, which I understand is 5kg. That is quite a lot of fireworks, by the way.

I am interested to hear what the Government thinks about the potential for group licences and licences that are obtained by nominated individuals on behalf of a group. There might be repercussions with regard to clarity about the liability of the licence holder, which would need to be discussed. For example, we would need to consider a situation where a group purchased stocks and used fireworks under one licence rather than placing liability on one unlucky individual. The Government might need to explore that further, but the point of stage 2 is to probe such issues. I am keen to hear the debate on my two amendments in the group.

I move amendment 67.

Yes, I am happy to concede that my amendment 68 might not be the solution to the conundrum, but it has shown that there is still a conundrum that is unaddressed. I do not know how the Government intends to respond at stage 3, but the matter needs to be fixed. It might be up to individual members to lodge amendments at stage 3 to clarify the position.

The debate also raises the wider issue of the exemptions and the permitted days of use, and it raises the very real concern that Pauline McNeill mentioned that many individuals in a group will simply use their individual licences to acquire fireworks and put on a display. It is very much an unregulated environment, in that respect. We could have a lot of people who just happen to be using their licences to buy and set off fireworks at the same time in the same place. Quelle surprise; what a coincidence. It is not a very co-ordinated approach to dealing with public displays. Therefore, I ask the Government to reflect on that point.

I do not have a view on raising the age; I have lodged amendment 67 because it is worth having a debate.

I am intrigued as to whether the Government has consulted on that specific question. By that I mean this: were the public ever asked if the minimum age for purchase of fireworks should be raised from 18 to 21? If that question was asked, what was the answer? If it was not, why? If we were to ask that question now—while the issue is on the public agenda—what would people say? It is not for me to conject what the public’s answer might be, but I guess that a fair proportion might be sympathetic to that—more so because the industry is sympathetic to it.

There is space for consultation around the issue or, at least—in the bill or somewhere in legislation—on the Government’s ability to change the age in the future. I presume that the bill is not set up so that the minimum age could be raised in the future, through this or other legislation, if it became apparent that that was the will of people, direction of travel or something that would benefit society.

Not agreeing to amendment 67—or not pressing it—will not address the issue that people aged between 16 to 21 are the group who are most likely to be offenders in misusing fireworks. For that reason, I have lodged amendments about education and so on, to which I will speak later.

On amendment 78, I accept the point that a licence might become invalid if the purchase history is not recorded—that would be a by-product of a bad solution. However, I disagree that the information is not useful or helpful. I think that it is very helpful and useful, so I make a plea that, as the licence scheme is developed, the information is recorded where it can be captured and if the technology is available. We still have not addressed the issue of how people might misuse their licence to make repeated purchases of products in various locations and from various sources, with a view to stockpiling and selling on the illegal market. That is a real possibility, and it is unclear how the issue will be monitored. The amendment, even if it is not worded properly, may provide a technical solution to monitor that.

I have an issue with what the minister said about amendment 76, however. I will need to check the Official Report, but I think that the minister said, “That is how we hope it will work in practice.” That is very different from having a legal duty. Section 9, “Grant of fireworks licence”, explicitly places a legal duty on ministers that they

“may grant a fireworks licence only if—

(a) a valid application and any applicable fees have been received,

(b) the requirements under section 6 and 7 have been met, and

(c) they are satisfied that the applicant can be permitted to possess and use fireworks safely and appropriately.”

What is missing is what amendment 76 would add, which is a requirement on ministers that

“they are satisfied that the information disclosed or provided by the applicant under section 7(1) is accurate”.

It is a fairly simple ask and I cannot see why it would be rejected.

I am keen to hear what other members think about amendment 59. I know that you are all shy this morning and it is early, but it is important that we have a proper debate about the issues.

The amendment does a number of things. It is a whole page in length, but it is fairly self-explanatory. First, it would require ministers to review current legislation

“in so far as it relates to the supply and use of fireworks and pyrotechnic articles”.

That is the important bit.

Secondly, ministers would have to determine, as a result of that review, whether any part of the legislation requires to be repealed as a result of the introduction of the bill, and whether any legislation must be introduced to address any gaps in existing legislation.

I should put on record a huge amount of thanks to the parliamentary legislation team for helping members to produce amendments. Through that team’s research and kind assistance, the amendment includes a list of the legislation that is most commonly used in the charging or prosecution of offenders relating to the illegal sale or misuse of fireworks and pyrotechnics. The list is not exhaustive. Proposed subsection (3)(j) would allow ministers to amend the list, where that is deemed appropriate.

That is the what, but I guess that the main question is about the why. It became apparent to committee members from the feedback from stakeholders that, rightly, we already have a large number of laws that regulate the use, sale and purchase of fireworks. However, we also heard that the reality is that those laws are not being used to their full extent. The evidence for that is abundant and self-explanatory—the numbers speak for themselves. For example, we know that it is already illegal under existing legislation to use a firework as a weapon, to use a firework for antisocial behaviour or to use a firework to attack emergency service workers. We also took evidence on that latter issue, and I hope that the committee agrees that we need to tackle it.

The problem is that we are seeking to introduce new legislation without a proper and full review of what is already in the public domain and how effectively we are using existing legislation to deal with the problems that the bill, in essence, seeks to deal with. Those issues are the misuse of fireworks, antisocial behaviour involving them and their illegal sale.

Over the past five years, Police Scotland have recorded more than 6,000 incidents involving the misuse of fireworks. That is quite a lot. Of those 6,000 incidents, 518 were recorded under the Explosive Substances Act 1883 and other pieces of legislation that relate, among other matters, to the keeping and supplying of explosives. Over that five-year period, arising from those incidents, only 136 charges were brought and, of those, only 16 resulted in a conviction. There is clearly a disproportionate ratio of incidents to criminal charges, prosecution and successful conviction. We will come to the issue of convictions in a subsequent group of amendments.

In fact, it has been impossible for the committee to quantify the scale of the problem of nuisance complaints about fireworks to the 101 number, via 999 to emergency services, to local authorities or to trading standards. However, we know that the conversion rate of incidents recorded to successful prosecution is pitiful. We might not have to rush the bill through in the way that we are if we used the laws that exist to their fullest extent. Amendment 59 asks the Government to do that.

In fact, in its evidence to the committee, the Scottish Community Safety Network questioned whether further legislation was needed at all. It said that

“New restrictions ... specify limits to the quantities of fireworks that can be sold, the times of sale, and times of use. Therefore, we suggest these measures are given adequate time to bed-in and take effect. This might help government, local authorities and industry measure the impact and inform which – if any – of the additional proposed restrictions are needed.”

We have listed specific laws in the amendment, including the Public Order Act 1986, which covers the majority of breach of the peace offences and offences relating to the use of dangerous items in a public place. My colleague Russell Findlay has lodged other amendments, which he will speak to later, that relate to widening the scope for offences that could or should bar people from owning a fireworks licence. We will come to that matter. However, what we are asking is not onerous. We want the Government to prepare and publish a review of the existing legislation specifically in relation to the sale and use—or indeed misuse—of fireworks and lay before the Parliament a report, presumably for debate and scrutiny. One would think that the Government would want to proactively maintain oversight of the use of laws that govern fireworks and pyrotechnics.

Although we have no ideological problem with adding new legislation such as this bill, it is clear that many people in our communities are blighted by the misuse of fireworks, and their use in antisocial behaviour, which is intensified and concentrated in geographic pockets. That is the issue that is not being clearly addressed. With the great range of powers that are already available to the police and prosecutors, people are rightly asking why that is not happening. I rightly ask why the Government cannot agree to conduct such an exercise. I look forward to hearing members’ feedback on that issue, which the committee’s stage 1 report flagged as a point of huge concern.

I move amendment 59.

If it is an offence for someone to purchase, possess or use fireworks without a licence unless they are explicitly exempt under the list in schedule 1, in what scenario does the minister foresee someone justifiably purchasing, possessing or using fireworks without a licence?

I thank the member for doing so. I do not disagree with his premise, but what is clear from feedback that we have taken directly from communities that have been most blighted by the misuse of fireworks is the lack of correlation between what they are reporting and what they are seeing at the other end. It is that inaction that is causing most frustration. It is hard to say whether new legislation will fix that or simply add to the legislative environment and landscape—I hope not. I am not saying that we should not add further legislation in the way that the Government is seeking—all that I am asking for is a review of the current landscape, because we do not have all the data available to us. It would be nice to know the correlation between the recording of such incidents and where those cases go in the justice system and to find out why they are not proceeding.

Last year, for example, there were 974 fireworks-related complaints to the police—in other words, nearly 1,000. However, only 29 charges were brought, and there were zero convictions. Pauline McNeill talked about public confidence in the system. How can the public have confidence in a system in which 1,000 offences directly related to fireworks are reported and nobody—nobody—is successfully prosecuted? How will this bill change that situation?

All that I am asking is for the Government to take a step back and look at whether the existing laws are being used. I cannot for the life of me work out why the Government, with all the resources available to it, would not want to do so.

This small group contains two of my amendments and amendment 46 in the name of Katy Clark, who will speak to that one.

Amendment 60 seeks to clarify who will be exempt from holding a licence. It relates to the main statement under section 4(1) of the bill that it will be

“an offence for a person ... to purchase, acquire, possess or use a firework ... without having a fireworks licence”,

which is the very essence of the Government’s proposal.

The term “without reasonable excuse” opens up a bit of a legal minefield of excuse making and lack of clarity. In fact, that wording is a defence solicitor’s dream. It is too vague, and my approach is to create clear blue water between those who must hold a licence and those who are explicitly exempt.

Exemptions are detailed in schedule 1 to the bill. I appreciate that “without reasonable excuse” is a commonly used legal term, but in the spirit of being crystal clear in the bill about who is and who is not required to hold a licence, I believe that reference to the exemption schedule—which could also be amended—is a better way of making clear who does not require a licence. If the Government can convince me otherwise, I am happy to listen to what the minister has to say.

Amendment 61 says that a person who holds a licence must present it at the point of purchase of fireworks. Specifically, it says that a person who holds a fireworks licence must be present at the point of purchase in all instances—both in person and online—irrespective of the location of the supplier.

I will speak about why the amendment is worded in that way; I apologise if it is not worded competently, but that is down to the timescale for drafting. The amendment seeks to shift the onus of responsibility for producing a licence to the licence holder. It means that at the point of purchase, the licence holder must present their licence to obtain fireworks. In the event of an in-person purchase in a retail store, that would be a physical process, and when making an online purchase, the licence holder would have to provide evidence that they hold a licence.

As the bill is currently drafted, I believe that there is a loophole that means that online retailers will not have to check for a licence. In fact, there may be a debate to be had about whether the Scottish Government or the Parliament can legislate to mandate retailers to check for the possession of such a licence—more so if that retailer is not based in Scotland or the United Kingdom.

Amendment 61 is short, but effective, given that shifting the onus to the purchaser is the only way to competently make a purchase. However, it does not address the wider issue of how on earth online firework sellers will verify that a Scotland-based customer or resident holds a licence, or whether they have had one that has subsequently been revoked. We struggled to draft an amendment that did that. Any online retailer could feasibly sell to any address registered in the UK after the bill passes, but it is unclear how the legislation would be dealt with by retailers.

If the Government considers that there is a better solution to this problem, I would be keen to hear the minister’s thoughts. If she is not minded to support my amendment, she must still outline why the bill contains no requirement to present a licence—physically or digitally—at the point of purchase, and how on earth the online sale of fireworks by suppliers outside Scotland or the UK when selling to Scottish consumers will be policed. That is not addressed in the bill and those questions remain unanswered.

I do not think that the issue can be kicked into the long grass of secondary legislation, because it is a key component in ensuring that we limit any opportunity for a black market, which is a very real risk—as so many of us have highlighted. Amendment 61 is meant to address that issue. If there is a better way to do that, I will be happy to withdraw my amendment and work with the Government to bring it back at stage 3.

I am keen to hear Ms Clark speak to amendment 46, which is slight in nature—it is a four-word amendment—but would have a big effect. It is quite unclear what she seeks to achieve with the amendment and, on a technical level, how the rest of the bill would be affected if it was agreed to. I have some concerns about the brevity of Ms Clark’s amendment and the nature of what it seeks to do. I will let her speak to that.

I move amendment 60.

I will give way in a second. You are welcome to clarify, if I am wrong.

The group could put on a display by using the licence of an individual in the group, but only during the permitted periods. That is my understanding; if I am wrong, I ask the minister to correct me.

I appreciate that very helpful feedback. I know that the amendment is of a more technical nature, but I would like clarification. If a community group wants to put on a display, it still has to nominate an individual who can use their own personal licence to purchase, possess and use fireworks on its behalf. That shifts the liability, responsibility and burden entirely on to the individual in question, not the group. Does that not strike you as a bit of a problem? Why will paid-for organisations and companies that put on professional displays be exempt from the need to hold a licence while community groups that want to put on a similar display will not be? We have not really addressed the issue of how community groups that are not in a commercial environment can put on displays other than through their having to rely on the good will of individuals in the group to use their licences and make multiple purchases of what could be fairly large volumes of fireworks. Does that not defeat the whole point of the bill?