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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 14 August 2025
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Displaying 1131 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee

Transgender Prisoners and Scottish Prisons

Meeting date: 22 February 2023

Rona Mackay

Would the person’s wishes be taken into account?

Criminal Justice Committee

Policing and Mental Health

Meeting date: 22 February 2023

Rona Mackay

I agree with what you have said about data collection—that is crucial. I have no objection to our going back to Police Scotland; I simply the question the worth of that.

I definitely think that we should go back to the SPA to get an update on the review that it is doing. We should also ask about the point that is made in paragraph 16 of our paper, which is about why the SPF does not really have a voice at SPA meetings and why the SPA takes Police Scotland’s evidence as read. In other words, we should ask the SPA how robust it is being with its governance. I would like us to see whether we get anywhere with that.

Criminal Justice Committee

Access to Court Transcripts

Meeting date: 22 February 2023

Rona Mackay

I am not disagreeing with what has been said, because we do need to ask questions, to see whether the Government can shine any light on the issue. The second last paragraph says that the SCTS will

“make information available on their webpages”,

which will include costs and information on how to get transcripts. Although I think that that is a move forward, questions still need to be asked.

Criminal Justice Committee

Transgender Prisoners and Scottish Prisons

Meeting date: 22 February 2023

Rona Mackay

Good morning. For clarity, Ms Medhurst, how long has the Prison Service been managing transgender prisoners in Scotland?

Criminal Justice Committee

Transgender Prisoners and Scottish Prisons

Meeting date: 22 February 2023

Rona Mackay

I am conscious of time. Would newly remanded prisoners who go to the establishment of their birth gender be segregated as a matter of course or could they be segregated if they requested it? I am thinking about their human rights in a situation where they have not been convicted of anything.

Criminal Justice Committee

Policing and Mental Health

Meeting date: 22 February 2023

Rona Mackay

I agree with Jamie Greene, in particular regarding paragraph 16, which states that

“The SPF raises a concern that the SPA bases its oversight on evidence provided by Police Scotland”,

and that the SPF does not have much input. I agree that we should take up that point.

I do not agree so much with Jamie Greene’s first point about going back to Police Scotland. We have been there, and Police Scotland knows that we are not happy with the response, as does the SPA. The SPA governs Police Scotland, so the onus is on the SPA to get this right for the police and for us, and to give us the information.

Paragraph 11 states:

“In response to the Committee’s request, the SPA undertook an urgent review of the number of cases where officers and staff retired due to mental ill health ... The SPA confirms in their response that additional resources have been assigned and are having a positive impact on reducing the number of officers awaiting approval”.

We have had no update on that urgent review, so we do not know what the outcome was.

Paragraph 11 goes on to note that

“The SPA’s People Committee is to consider the outcomes of the review at its meeting of 28 February”.

It might be timely, therefore, for us to contact the SPA and ask what the outcome of the review was. I am not sure of the value of going back to Police Scotland, because I think that we will just get the same response.

Criminal Justice Committee

Transgender Prisoners and Scottish Prisons

Meeting date: 22 February 2023

Rona Mackay

For clarification, you talked about setting up the operating procedure. In the interim period, what would happen to a newly remanded or convicted transgender prisoner? Would they go to an establishment for prisoners of their birth gender?

Criminal Justice Committee

Transgender Prisoners and Scottish Prisons

Meeting date: 22 February 2023

Rona Mackay

In the lessons learned review, you said that

“newly convicted or remanded transgender prisoners will initially be placed in an establishment commensurate with their birth gender.”

Is there a timescale on that? Does the individual have to appeal to be moved to a different prison?

Criminal Justice Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 8 February 2023

Rona Mackay

I have a supplementary question. I understand what Jamie Greene is saying, but I think that he is overthinking it a wee bit.

We would need to see the Official Report, but what was said in the committee’s report could have been taken out of context, slightly. It is perfectly reasonable for the cabinet secretary to say that those are operational matters and that he would not take control of them. I think that that is what it is about, but I appreciate that Jamie would like more information about where the money will go. However, that is surely up to the chief constable.

Criminal Justice Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 8 February 2023

Rona Mackay

I agree with all the points that have been made. I am really pleased about the multiyear funding for victims services.

I am also pleased that the modernisation of the prison estate and the new female prison will go ahead. Jamie Greene asks whether it is magic cash or new money. I do not know whether it is either of those but, to be honest, the fact that it will happen is the main thing, from my point of view.