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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 18 June 2025
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Displaying 1354 contributions

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SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

That is interesting. We have both engaged with organisations such as the Scottish Commission on Social Security—SCOSS—so there are bodies that fulfil some aspects of that function. However, your argument is that there should be a comprehensive approach.

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

As the former Minister for Social Security and Local Government, I am very aware of that. It is helpful of you to set it all out for our evidence and as part of the discussion on the wider landscape, so I thank you for detailing the legacy and the nuance. Much of the scenario that the committee is considering relates to the position that has built up through legacy; we will get into more of that shortly.

In your written submission, interestingly, you categorise SPCB bodies as “less complex” in relation to audits. Can you comment further on how Audit Scotland ensures that the audit process for those less complex bodies is proportionate to their size and their complexity?

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

That is helpful, and it dovetails into my next question. In some of the committee’s previous evidence sessions, office holders highlighted that, in some instances, recommendations that were provided to smaller organisations were not tailored to the specific organisations. I would be grateful if you could clarify further what measures are in place to ensure that the recommendations that are provided during audits are sufficiently specific to, and actionable for, smaller organisations.

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

Auditor General, you have provided us with a lot of information, insights, context and clarifications this morning that will be really helpful to our task in this review. Is there anything else that you want to say that you have not been able to express in answer to the questions that we have posed?

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

Good morning, everyone, and welcome to the sixth meeting in 2025 of the SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee. I have received no apologies.

Today, the committee will take evidence from the Auditor General for Scotland, and then from ˿ who have proposals for bills that would create new Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body supported bodies. I am pleased to welcome Stephen Boyle, the Auditor General for Scotland.

Auditor General, in the past few weeks, an emerging theme of the committee’s work has been the number of public bodies. We know what the role of each body is, and we know how people can get an understanding of that. In an evidence session that we had with the Scottish Information Commissioner a few weeks ago, he referred to the number of public bodies and to the discussions that he had had with you about that. Do you want to touch on that first, and feed back anything that you wish to say to us and to the Parliament in that regard?

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

Welcome back. I am pleased to welcome to the meeting our colleagues Jeremy Balfour, Colin Smyth and Sarah Boyack, and Roz Thomson, who is head of the Scottish Parliament’s non-Government bills unit. Thank you for being with us.

Before I invite other members to ask questions, I will put some generic ones to you all. What do you consider to be the benefit of an SPCB supported commissioner? In your proposals, why have you opted for such a model over other options, such as a Government-supported body, which could also demonstrate independence from Government?

I saw Jeremy Balfour nodding, so I will go to him first.

10:30  

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

Commissioners sometimes appear in front of their subject committees if a particular piece of work is being done, but it is helpful for us to reflect on your custom and practice of regularly being in this institution, in relation to the common good or public good, as you referred to. Thank you for elaborating on that matter.

10:15  

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

Your points about scrutinising and monitoring implementation are extremely important. As things stand, there is a question for us about our examination of that more widely and across the bodies. Thank you for elaborating further on that.

I am sorry that I interrupted you, Lorna.

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

I am grateful to you for reflecting on the evidence that we have heard and giving your view on it.

I move to questions from our colleague, Murdo Fraser.

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

Thank you very much, Mr Balfour. I am sure that we will come on to our witnesses’ various areas of interest—in your case, the interests of disabled people and the operation of the current SPCB supported bodies.

You have just touched on issues that are experienced by older people, including pensioners, which helpfully segues into the area that Colin Smyth’s proposal covers. Will you answer my question, Colin, please?