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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 19 December 2025
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Displaying 1177 contributions

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Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 10 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

That is a really useful question.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 10 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

I am sorry to intervene, but you have touched on some of the points that some of my colleagues might bring up on tokenisation. Thank you very much for those remarks, but I want to bring in Professor Schafer, and I then want to return to the points around terminology—particularly whether the terms “rivalrousness” and “immutability” are well understood.

Professor Schafer, do you have any thoughts on the overall approach? Given that I have flagged that I will ask about those novel concepts, do you also have any contributions on those?

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

With that, we have come to the conclusion of our questions. I thank our witnesses for their very insightful contributions. You have given us yet more to think about—I am not sure that we are entirely thankful for that. We will go away and contemplate your evidence during our deliberations.

12:23 Meeting continued in private until 12:42.  

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

I will ask another question before I bring in colleagues. I assume that, from your perspective, the purpose of the bill is to facilitate transactions—that is, it needs to capture that digital assets are things that can be owned and therefore can form part of interpersonal or commercial transactions, although I would guess that the transactions will be more in the latter domain. Is that the correct way to understand where the usefulness of the bill lies? To what extent is some of that already happening, both broadly and particularly within the Scots law jurisdiction?

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

There is centralised control.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Mr Gray, I will bring you in, given that you work for a firm that specialises in commercial law. Do you agree with those points? Does the bill do what it needs to do in order to capture ownership, or is it missing elements, as we have just heard?

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Good morning, and welcome to the 34th meeting in 2025 of the Economy and Fair Work Committee. This morning we will continue our evidence-taking sessions on the Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill with two panels. The first panel comprises Professor William Buchanan, director, and Peter Ferry, chief executive officer, both of the Scottish Centre of Excellence in Digital Trust and DLT; and Jamie Gray, partner, financial services regulatory team, at the solicitors firm Burness Paull LLP. We have received apologies from Sarah Boyack, Murdo Fraser and Stephen Kerr.

We will go straight to questions, if that is acceptable to the witnesses. The Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill is a short bill that brings digital assets within the scope of objects of property in Scots law. Does the bill adequately capture the definition? Will that be useful and usable, given the scope of current uses—and of potential future uses—of digital assets? Who would like to answer that question? Professor Buchanan, you seem to be trying to catch my eye.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

You mentioned that there is a difference between permissioned and non-permissioned ledgers. Is that the same thing as your point about consensus?

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

To play devil’s advocate, I assume that a point that might be made in contrast is that although the bill might not capture and describe in detail the precise nature of every type of digital asset, it is trying to capture some of the fundamentals. At the very least, it is trying to define them in law and give an account of ownership and legal consideration, even if some of the underlying mechanics are not captured.

For example—I am mindful that there is a lawyer on the panel, who should feel free to correct me—possession is not necessarily the same thing as ownership. Some of these concepts may be analogous to that. Even if the bill does not capture the precise details of all the mechanics, it says that there are digital things, that they are discrete and that they can be owned. Are there still flaws in that? If that argument was put to you, what would be the issues with it?

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Before I hand over to colleagues, I will come back to immutability, which seems to be one of the critical points. There is an absolute view of immutability as meaning that something is completely unchangeable, but I do not know whether that is possible in any circumstances, whether we are talking about physical objects or otherwise. Notionally, it strikes me that a digital asset that clearly exists as ones and zeros in an electronic system can be alterable, but the system is designed not to be. Is the immutability test sufficiently robust and clear in law, in terms of meaning that the design function of the system cannot be changed, as opposed to the physical nature of the thing?