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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 20 June 2025
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Displaying 3231 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of the Commissioner for Ethical Standards in Public Life in Scotland”

Meeting date: 27 January 2022

Richard Leonard

As always, Auditor General, thank you very much for the frankness of your replies. I also take this opportunity to thank Richard Robinson as well as Pat Kenny of Deloitte, who have joined us online this morning.

That ends the public part of the meeting, and we now move into private session.

11:05 Meeting continued in private until 11:46.  

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of the Commissioner for Ethical Standards in Public Life in Scotland”

Meeting date: 27 January 2022

Richard Leonard

So is it that there was a policy, but it was not fit for purpose, or is it that there was a policy, but people were not sufficiently aware of it?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of the Commissioner for Ethical Standards in Public Life in Scotland”

Meeting date: 27 January 2022

Richard Leonard

We will end where we started, with the comment in the Auditor General’s opening statement that this is all about public trust in the complaints system and how complaints are dealt with. What stands out in the report are recurring phrases such as “substantial weaknesses” and the need for “significant improvements”, and in paragraph 26, the report concludes:

“The overarching risk is a loss of public trust in the ability of the Commissioner’s Office to properly investigate and consider complaints made against the conduct of individuals in public life in Scotland.”

What is your assessment of where things stand today? Is there an existing crisis of confidence in the system?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of the Scottish Government Consolidated Accounts”

Meeting date: 27 January 2022

Richard Leonard

I do not want to put words in your mouth, but are you saying that the risk and uncertainty is being fuelled by the collapse of Greensill Capital, which was the primary funder of GFG Alliance? GFG Alliance itself is the subject of a Serious Fraud Office investigation, because issues have been raised about its governance structure, which one UK minister described as “opaque”. Concerns have been expressed about changes to the accounting periods that the company is using. Auditors have resigned and finance directors have left. Is all that fuelling the assessment of heightened risk to which the Scottish Government is now exposed?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of the Commissioner for Ethical Standards in Public Life in Scotland”

Meeting date: 27 January 2022

Richard Leonard

Colin Beattie has a series of questions.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of the Scottish Government Consolidated Accounts”

Meeting date: 27 January 2022

Richard Leonard

Colin Beattie has a series of questions on governance.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of the Scottish Government Consolidated Accounts”

Meeting date: 27 January 2022

Richard Leonard

My understanding is that the Scottish Government is now looking at the production of such a framework. As you mentioned, there has been a long-standing call for that from Audit Scotland, from you and your predecessor. Do you know when that framework will be published?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of the Commissioner for Ethical Standards in Public Life in Scotland”

Meeting date: 27 January 2022

Richard Leonard

Thank you very much indeed. Sharon Dowey has a series of questions to ask.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of the Commissioner for Ethical Standards in Public Life in Scotland”

Meeting date: 27 January 2022

Richard Leonard

So nothing has been finalised yet.

There is a section on whistleblowing in the report. I want to get this right: that refers to whistleblowing for employees of the organisation, not whistleblowers who have a part to play in complaints that come to the organisation. I am sure that there is a Latin equivalent of this. Given that I presume that the organisation deals, from time to time, with complaints by people who are covered by the public interest disclosure legislation—people who are whistleblowers—that begs the question why there is not, within an organisation that looks at those matters, an effective whistleblowing policy. A recommendation has been made that that needs to be addressed. Where are we with that?

11:00  

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2020/21 audit of National Records of Scotland”

Meeting date: 20 January 2022

Richard Leonard

Yes. I think that it would be useful if you could take us through the broad themes of that and why you arrived at the decision to postpone.