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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 22 June 2025
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Displaying 3231 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802â€

Meeting date: 26 May 2022

Richard Leonard

We may well return to that.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802â€

Meeting date: 26 May 2022

Richard Leonard

That is fine.

I will now bring in Craig Hoy; I can come back to Sharon Dowey shortly.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802â€

Meeting date: 26 May 2022

Richard Leonard

Fran Pacitti made an extremely important point about the role of challenge in making decisions. The cost was going to be £97 million of public money. In the end, it has ended up being considerably more than that. The role of challenge in such decisions is primary. As the Public Audit Committee of the Parliament, we would expect challenge.

Will you explain a bit more about the relationship that ought to exist between the portfolio accountable officer and the decision maker? Will you also explain whether there is a role in the process for the director general of finance? Is part of their role not to challenge investment decisions that are taken at portfolio level to see whether they pass the tests that are set out in the public finance manual?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802â€

Meeting date: 26 May 2022

Richard Leonard

I begin by putting a question to Roy Brannen and Hugh Gillies, but I will take you first, Mr Brannen. You mentioned current and previous roles. You have both held the post of designated accountable officer for Transport Scotland, so can you outline what is required in that role in providing formal advice to ministers and recording decisions, particularly where significant concerns or risks are involved?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802â€

Meeting date: 26 May 2022

Richard Leonard

Audit Scotland’s report notes that there were 15 intervals of payment rather than the typical five. For the record, can you tell us the reasons for that?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802â€

Meeting date: 26 May 2022

Richard Leonard

One of the things that I have drawn from today’s session is that a lot of responsibility and accountability seems to have been placed at the level of the builder and the buyer, but the whole apparatus of accountability in the civil service does not seem to have been applied.

Public Audit Committee

Decision on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 26 May 2022

Richard Leonard

Good morning. I welcome everyone to the 16th meeting of the Public Audit Committee in 2022. The first item of business is for members of the committee to consider whether to take agenda items 3, 4 and 5 in private. Do members agree to take those items in private?

Members indicated agreement.

Public Audit Committee

Major Capital Projects: Accountability and Governance Arrangements

Meeting date: 19 May 2022

Richard Leonard

I have one final question, for the moment. Helen Carter, Nick Ford and Andrew Watson are on the IIB. Who is on the infrastructure advisory group?

Public Audit Committee

Major Capital Projects: Accountability and Governance Arrangements

Meeting date: 19 May 2022

Richard Leonard

Are they published on the Scottish Government website?

Public Audit Committee

Major Capital Projects: Accountability and Governance Arrangements

Meeting date: 19 May 2022

Richard Leonard

That would indeed be very helpful.

Let me deal with a contemporary issue that has its roots in a bit of history, namely, private finance initiative and public-private partnership contracts. I cannot remember whether it was in the programme for government, but I am reminded of when the First Minister announced—fairly recently—that the 24-bed East Ayrshire community hospital was going to be taken out of PFI and brought back into the public sector, as almost an early glimpse of what was to come.

We know that those contracts are coming up towards the end of their period of private operation. We are interested in understanding a bit more about how that is working and what the plans are to manage that transition. The 24-bed East Ayrshire community hospital is small, but there are some big projects with presumably quite significant revenue implications for the public sector coming towards the end of their life in the private sector. Are they all coming into the public sector? What will that look like? What plans does the Government have to manage that transition and run those assets after they have been transferred?