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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 3 July 2025
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Displaying 3287 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Early Learning and Childcare: Progress on delivery of the 1,140 hours expansion”

Meeting date: 5 October 2023

Richard Leonard

I want to take you back to the questions about demand for childcare and how that is being assessed and what data is being collected. I think that Willie Coffey and Graham Simpson wanted to come in on that, but Colin Beattie was on a roll, so I let him continue.

Willie Coffey, do you want to come in on that issue before you move on to your other questions? Graham Simpson also wants to come in on this data set stuff.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Early Learning and Childcare: Progress on delivery of the 1,140 hours expansion”

Meeting date: 5 October 2023

Richard Leonard

It is an entitlement for those families and children that does not appear to have been fulfilled. It is a failing of this part of the policy, isn’t it?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Early Learning and Childcare: Progress on delivery of the 1,140 hours expansion”

Meeting date: 5 October 2023

Richard Leonard

Sorry, but what I am asking, Mr Rennick, is to do with what you said about 84 per cent of providers meeting the criterion of paying their staff at least the living wage, which means that 16 per cent did not. What leverage do you have over that 16 per cent?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Early Learning and Childcare: Progress on delivery of the 1,140 hours expansion”

Meeting date: 5 October 2023

Richard Leonard

As we reflected in the previous evidence session that we had with the Auditor General, that is an implementation group. That is its title, is it not? It is the ELC living wage and fair work implementation group. What is its role in ensuring that fair work and living wage conditions are implemented? Matthew Sweeney, I do not know whether you can answer that.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Early Learning and Childcare: Progress on delivery of the 1,140 hours expansion”

Meeting date: 5 October 2023

Richard Leonard

Good. Graham Simpson wants to ask some questions.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Early Learning and Childcare: Progress on delivery of the 1,140 hours expansion”

Meeting date: 5 October 2023

Richard Leonard

A final quick question from me. You mentioned a couple of times about the real living wage being paid. That has been announced as an uprating to ÂŁ12 an hour, so a rate of at least ÂŁ12 an hour is what we are speaking about here. You said that that would be funded by the Scottish Government. Do you know for sure that all employers in the voluntary, private and public sectors are paying their staff the real living wage? Do you monitor that? How do you know that?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Early Learning and Childcare: Progress on delivery of the 1,140 hours expansion”

Meeting date: 5 October 2023

Richard Leonard

What do you do about the 16 per cent?

Public Audit Committee

Decision on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 5 October 2023

Richard Leonard

Good morning, and welcome, everyone, to the 25th meeting in 2023 of the Public Audit Committee. The first item on the agenda is a decision on whether to take items 3, 4 and 5 in private. Are members of the committee content to do that?

Members indicated agreement.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Early Learning and Childcare: Progress on delivery of the 1,140 hours expansion”

Meeting date: 5 October 2023

Richard Leonard

The committee’s main agenda item is item 2, which is a session on the Auditor General for Scotland and Accounts Commission section 23 report “Early Learning and Childcare: Progress on delivery of the 1,140 hours expansion”. I am pleased that we are joined by four representatives today. We are joined, from the Scottish Government, by Neil Rennick, director general for education and justice, and Eleanor Passmore, deputy director for early learning and childcare, and, from the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities, by Matthew Sweeney, policy manager for children and young people, and Joanna Anderson, policy manager for local government and finance.

Before we ask questions of the Scottish Government team and the representatives from COSLA, I ask Mr Rennick to give an opening statement.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Early Learning and Childcare: Progress on delivery of the 1,140 hours expansion”

Meeting date: 5 October 2023

Richard Leonard

Thank you. When we took evidence previously, one of the elements that we were interested in was construction inflation, which was defined as being about 30 per cent—considerably higher than even the retail prices index and the consumer prices index. We were not clear on what you have identified as the principal drivers for inflation in the construction sector. Can you shed any light on that?