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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 26 August 2025
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Displaying 2049 contributions

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Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pension Age Disability Payment

Meeting date: 9 May 2024

Bob Doris

I was struck by Debbie Horne’s comments about human rights-based budgeting. I get the point that she makes. I am the convener of the cross-party group on rare, genetic and undiagnosed conditions and the CPG on palliative and end-of-life care. Demands on budgets are such that the people who are affected by those issues would also demand human rights-based budgeting to fulfil their expectation that their human rights will be met. I appreciate what Ms Horne says, but it can be quite simplistic to look at it in that way.

From a budgeting point of view, £580 million is clearly eye-watering and simply not affordable, even though it would be positive to introduce a mobility component. If £20 million was available to improve the lives of older people, how would Ms Horne or Mr Stachura spend it? That would bring to life how we prioritise budgets in the Parliament.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pension Age Disability Payment

Meeting date: 9 May 2024

Bob Doris

My understanding of the child disability payment is that the qualifying period is not a simple three months but three months with an expectation that the condition will endure for a further nine months. Does that cast a bit more doubt on the Scottish Government’s cost assumptions of £21 million?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pension Age Disability Payment

Meeting date: 9 May 2024

Bob Doris

Those were really helpful comments from both witnesses. Thank you.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pension Age Disability Payment

Meeting date: 9 May 2024

Bob Doris

That is helpful. Adam Stachura?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pension Age Disability Payment

Meeting date: 9 May 2024

Bob Doris

One of the differences appears to be that, with child disability payment, the opportunity was taken to be a bit more consistent in relation to whether renal dialysis is deemed to qualify a person for the higher rate or the lower rate. If renal dialysis is required both day and night, a person could qualify for the higher rate. The Scottish Government has not taken that opportunity with the regulations that we are considering, but it has said that it could rely on guidance that would clarify that, which might improve outcomes, if I have understood the matter correctly. Marilyn Howard, I suspect, has a considered view from SCOSS on that. Will relying on guidance be sufficient?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pension Age Disability Payment

Meeting date: 9 May 2024

Bob Doris

Can I check my understanding? If someone is currently on renal dialysis, they automatically get the lower rate for pension age disability payment, and the devil will be in the detail of the guidance in relation to whether night-time dialysis will mean that they get the higher rate. Have I understood that correctly? Is SCOSS content with that approach?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pension Age Disability Payment

Meeting date: 9 May 2024

Bob Doris

I point out that I do not have £20 million, Mr Stachura.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pension Age Disability Payment

Meeting date: 9 May 2024

Bob Doris

I have put words into your mouth, so I apologise.

I do not know whether Marilyn Howard has anything to add, but I have no further questions. Marilyn, do you have any observations on that?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pension Age Disability Payment

Meeting date: 9 May 2024

Bob Doris

That is helpful: the issue is covered by guidance for the moment and may be part of a review in the longer term. If no other witness wants to add anything, I will move to another question.

The Scottish Government will not shorten the six-month qualifying period for pension age disability payment as, according to it, to do so

“would lead to people with very short-term conditions becoming eligible”.

The Scottish Government also refers to the cost, which is coincidentally roughly £20 million—I promise that that is not a deliberate link to my previous question—and the risk to passported benefits being compromised. What are the witnesses’ views of those justifications?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pension Age Disability Payment

Meeting date: 9 May 2024

Bob Doris

That is helpful. I wanted that on the record. It is about the art of the achievable rather than the aspirations. We are very well intentioned. I totally get why you want the mobility component, Ms Horne.

Mr Stachura, what would your priority be?