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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 23 June 2025
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Displaying 3510 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26 (United Kingdom Context)

Meeting date: 26 November 2024

Kenneth Gibson

It is greatly appreciated that you have come here in person. It makes a big difference to our scrutiny. Thank you very much.

That finishes the public part of our meeting. I will call a five-minute break to enable our witnesses, broadcasting staff and official report staff to leave.

11:16 Meeting continued in private until 12:14.  

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26 (United Kingdom Context)

Meeting date: 26 November 2024

Kenneth Gibson

You have said that a quarter of a million employers gain from the budget, 940,000 employers lose out and 820,000 employers see no change.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26 (United Kingdom Context)

Meeting date: 26 November 2024

Kenneth Gibson

In table 2.1 on page 19, you say that from 2019 up to 2028, GDP is expected to rise by a cumulative 4.3 per cent, which puts the 4 per cent impact of Brexit into some context. Just over 4 per cent in nine years is kind of pitiful, really. The UK economy appears to be somewhat atherosclerotic, because in table A.1 on page 168, you say that the

“World GDP at purchasing power parity”

is expected to grow between 3.1 per cent and 3.3 per cent from 2023 onwards, which is more than six times that of the UK. What is your perspective on that, and how can we break that cycle of stagnation?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26 (United Kingdom Context)

Meeting date: 26 November 2024

Kenneth Gibson

In your “Economic and fiscal outlook” report, you say:

“The outlook for productivity growth remains our most important and uncertain forecast judgement.”

You go on to say:

“The effects of subdued investment, the energy price shock, and Brexit compound the ongoing weakness seen since the financial crisis.”

Productivity growth is of great concern to the committee; we have raised it on numerous occasions in numerous fora with different people. How can we break the productivity bottleneck? You have also raised concerns about the number of people who are economically inactive. As a percentage of the population, there are now more people who are economically inactive in Scotland than there are in the UK.

Do you see the way to break the productivity problem being through technology and migration? What impact is demography—the ageing of the indigenous population, if you want to put it that way, or the people who live here already—having on productivity? One would think that migration and technological advances would improve productivity, but an ageing population is creating a drag on it.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26 (United Kingdom Context)

Meeting date: 26 November 2024

Kenneth Gibson

In your Scottish report, you touch on a couple of issues—air passenger duty, and the final timing for that, and VAT assignment. To this committee, the latter is a dog that just will not die. The committee has made it clear to the Scottish Government that, although it might have been in the Smith commission report, we do not see any advantage whatsoever to assignment of VAT. We could argue about whether or not it should be devolved. In section 8 of the report, you say:

“The formal methodology for VAT assignment is being developed by HMRC, the Treasury and the Scottish Government.”

Is there any point in progressing any further with that? The committee does not see that there is.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Schools (Residential Outdoor Education) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 19 November 2024

Kenneth Gibson

We could be talking about £100 million over three years, which is a very significant amount of money, and the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities is obviously nervous about where those funds will be sourced from. It is looking for a guarantee that local government will not be left carrying the can, which is why I asked you whether you think that the funding should be ring fenced. You might be able to set up a trust, and money might come from PEF, but it does not seem to me that that represents a guaranteed source of funding year in, year out, so to speak.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Schools (Residential Outdoor Education) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 19 November 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Other colleagues will want to explore some issues further, including one or two that I have not touched on. However, there is one further thing from me. Today, your Holyrood leader called for tax cuts of £1 billion a year. Your party has also called on the Scottish Government to mitigate a number of things such as the situation on winter fuel payments. If we have £1 billion in tax cuts and we mitigate here, there and everywhere—national insurance, blah, blah, blah—where would the bill fit into the list of priorities in a budget in which there would be less money to spend?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Schools (Residential Outdoor Education) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 19 November 2024

Kenneth Gibson

We fully appreciate that and, all else being equal, I do not think there would be any argument at all against it. However, we must look at the budget, at teacher numbers and at the cost of outdoor provision. Where do you sit on that?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Schools (Residential Outdoor Education) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 19 November 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I think that the issue is the indefinite nature of that sort of funding. Trusts might or might not come in, but the question is how to sustain that funding year in, year out.

I have one other question about the issue of timescales, which was touched on earlier. You are keen for this to start in 2026, but I have to say that there seems to be no build-up to it. The costings suggest almost full delivery in year 1, and I cannot see how that can possibly happen, given that some facilities will have to be refurbished and additional facilities will surely have to come online. Would it not be better for the provision to be scaled up over, say, three years?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Revenue Scotland

Meeting date: 19 November 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I was thinking exactly the same thing, funnily enough.