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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 9 September 2025
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Displaying 3573 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 26 September 2023

Kenneth Gibson

I hope that we will get more detail on that in the financial memorandum. I do not expect you to say, for example, 63.5 per cent, but it would be helpful to know the ballpark shares that we are talking about鈥攑erhaps two thirds or a half.

I appreciate the time given by the minister and her officials. In order to prepare for the next evidence session, we will have a wee break.

10:35 Meeting suspended.  

10:41&苍产蝉辫;翱苍&苍产蝉辫;谤别蝉耻尘颈苍驳鈥&苍产蝉辫;&苍产蝉辫;

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Sustainability of Scotland鈥檚 Finances

Meeting date: 26 September 2023

Kenneth Gibson

I had an Ardnamurchan holiday back in 1998 or 1999 and it was exactly like that then. It is clearly an issue in that part of Scotland. The only thing that I could get to feed the kids was beans, chips and chicken nuggets, which was not what I wanted to feed them. That was a quarter of a century ago.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Sustainability of Scotland鈥檚 Finances

Meeting date: 26 September 2023

Kenneth Gibson

I thank our witnesses for their contributions. We have run a wee bit over our time, but that is testament to the evidence that we have heard today. We will continue taking evidence on the sustainability of Scotland鈥檚 finances at our next meeting, when we will hear from the Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Finance.

That concludes the public part of today鈥檚 meeting. The next item on our agenda, which we will discuss in private, is consideration of our work programme. We will move into private session and there will be a two minute break to allow our witnesses to leave.

12:24 Meeting continued in private until 12:34.  

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 26 September 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Thank you. It is important to get that clarification on the record.

One of the things that concerns me鈥擨 am sure that other members will raise this issue鈥攊s that the costs that have been provided, such as those for 2021-22, 2022-23 and the current year, do not give us much more than the top-line costs. It would be useful to dig down into the costs, so I will do a wee bit of digging and I am sure that colleagues will do more of that as the meeting progresses.

In your opening statement, you talked about the need to look again at the profiling of expenditure. The annex in our papers shows the actual costs after revision, which are obviously the most important ones. In 2021-22, 拢1.387 million was spent on staff. In the following year, the figure increased quite dramatically to 拢9.8 million. One would anticipate that, because a lot more work was done to flesh out the bill. However, in the first quarter of the current financial year, the figure seems to have fallen back quite significantly to 拢923,000, which is only about a third of the quarterly spend in the previous financial year. Can you explain why there has been such a dramatic change in those figures?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 26 September 2023

Kenneth Gibson

It would have been useful to have more detail on that.

I will let in colleagues in just a second, but minister, do you agree that the bill now seems to be about evolution rather than revolution? Has the big bang that we saw last year and which hit the rocks of a financial memorandum that just did not add up been transformed? Is the Government now looking at putting in place something radically different than what it was going to put in place a year ago?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Sustainability of Scotland鈥檚 Finances

Meeting date: 26 September 2023

Kenneth Gibson

The next item on our agenda is to continue taking evidence on the sustainability of Scotland鈥檚 finances as part of our pre-budget scrutiny. I welcome Rachel Cook, deputy head of policy, Federation of Small Businesses Scotland; Sandy Begbie CBE, chief executive officer, Scottish Financial Enterprise; and Louise Maclean, business development director, Signature Pubs, who is representing the Scottish Hospitality Group.

I intend to allow up to 75 minutes for this session. I say to our witnesses that, when they want to be brought into the discussion, they should indicate to me or the clerks and I will call them. You do not all have to answer every question but, if I put a question to an individual, feel free to say that you wish to comment as well. We have your written submissions, so we will move straight to questions, which I will open. Eeny, meeny, miny, moe鈥攚ho will I put my first question to? I will put it to the FSB.

The FSB has talked a lot, as has the Scottish Hospitality Group, about support for businesses, which is of fundamental importance for your sector and for the Scottish economy. Where are we on that? The FSB has said:

鈥渕ore than half of the businesses who responded [to our survey] do not feel Scotland is currently an attractive place to start up a business鈥.

First, how does that relate to other parts of the UK, Ireland or anywhere else? It is important to get that in context. Secondly, will you talk us through what the Scottish Government could do to make Scotland a more attractive place in which to do business?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Sustainability of Scotland鈥檚 Finances

Meeting date: 26 September 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Sandy, what can we do through the budget to ensure that the Scottish financial sector remains competitive?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Sustainability of Scotland鈥檚 Finances

Meeting date: 26 September 2023

Kenneth Gibson

I think that we would all agree that we need a lot more 25-year-olds in Scotland鈥檚 working population.

11:15  

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Sustainability of Scotland鈥檚 Finances

Meeting date: 26 September 2023

Kenneth Gibson

So, in areas where Scotland has an advantage鈥攆or example, the small business bonus scheme鈥攚e should pay additional rates relief, but in areas where the UK has an advantage, we should ensure that all Barnett consequentials go into the sector. It would be a double-win for the sector, but it would impact on other areas of the Scottish budget. If that 拢85 million is to be used in hospitality and other sectors, where in the Scottish budget should the Scottish Government take it from?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Sustainability of Scotland鈥檚 Finances

Meeting date: 26 September 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Is 拢15 million a realistic sum?