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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 26 August 2025
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Displaying 3539 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Report on Climate Change and Fiscal Sustainability)

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Is it disproportionate?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Have you no other sources of information? You were clearly aware of it. I thought that there would at least have been an inflationary uplift over the past 18 months, even given your caveat about submissions from Police Scotland and others.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Thank you very much. That has concluded questions from the committee, but I have one or two more.

You seem to have more or less accepted Police Scotland’s figures now that it has provided them. What level of interrogation of those figures has the bill team undertaken?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I have to say, though, that I am frankly astonished that it seems that it was only when the committee’s call for evidence went out that you realised that there was a need to review the figures, and yet we still ended up with figures from September 2022.

We talked about the process document—the bill handbook—being a living document. However, surely, a financial memorandum should be a living document up until it is presented to the committee in an updated form. If you know that the figures are inaccurate, the fact that you come here with something that bears no resemblance to the actual figures shows a real misunderstanding of the role of the committee, the processes of the Parliament and, indeed, the timescale in which scrutiny has to take place. Do you accept that?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Report on Climate Change and Fiscal Sustainability)

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I will touch on your report in a wee minute, but what you have said is, in effect, that, because Scotland has 70 per cent of the UK’s peatlands, it might be more difficult for Scotland to afford the sort of peatland restoration that is absolutely critical to tackling climate change, because that work would account for a higher proportion of our budget than it would of the UK’s. In that case, does that aspect of the fiscal framework—that is, the aspect relating to climate change—have to be looked at again, or should it just be overlaid by the existing fiscal framework? What is your view on that?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Report on Climate Change and Fiscal Sustainability)

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Thank you for that and for the interesting and sobering report. I should say that I am not particularly thrilled by the introduction of acronyms such as LULUCF, which means land use, land use change and forestry, although it is clearly important. As you have just pointed out, there is a disproportionate cost to Scotland compared to the cost to the rest of the UK. In paragraph 21 of the report, you point out that the cost in Scotland per person per year of the investment in mitigation is £207, whereas in the rest of the UK it is £149, which is a £58 difference. However, you point out that £54 of that £58 is simply because of land use, land use change and forestry.

Given that that is a huge additional burden to fall on Scotland over many years, should consideration be given to the devolved settlement through the block grant to take that into account?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Report on Climate Change and Fiscal Sustainability)

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Paragraph 38 of your report states that, as has been mentioned,

“Coordination and cooperation by the UK and Scottish Governments will be required to succeed in reducing emissions.â€

However, the two Governments might have different policy and spending priorities. Ultimately, therefore, Scotland will be at the mercy of those UK Government decisions, will it not? For example, a future UK Government might decide that it would rather spend the money somewhere else.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Report on Climate Change and Fiscal Sustainability)

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

LULUCF.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Report on Climate Change and Fiscal Sustainability)

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Thank you for yet another excellent report. We have a commitment from the Deputy First Minister to having a debate on fiscal sustainability between now and the summer recess, and we will continue to press for that.

Thank you for all your evidence and for answering our questions. I hope that members will be able to come to the Scottish Parliament information centre event from 8.30 to 9.30 tomorrow morning in the Holyrood room. Bacon rolls and scrambled eggs are included, and I look forward to seeing you tomorrow.

With that, I move the meeting into private session. The public proceedings are finished for the day, and there will be a five-minute break to allow the witnesses and the official report to leave and to give members a natural break.

12:01 Meeting continued in private until 12:27.  

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I will now open it up to colleagues. The first to ask questions will be Liz Smith, followed by Michelle Thomson.