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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 14 August 2025
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Displaying 751 contributions

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Citizen Participation and Public Petitions Committee

Continued Petitions

Meeting date: 14 June 2023

Fergus Ewing

I understand that those are all complex matters, and I know that you have been in regular dialogue with CECA, which you meet several times a year. What I do not understand鈥擨 do not say this to be recriminatory鈥攊s that you have admitted mea culpa, that the system is broken and that it is not fit for purpose, which is patently the case and has been obvious for quite a long time. Surely, therefore, particularly over the past couple of years of this parliamentary session, the advice about precisely how the contract should be changed鈥攖o perhaps some form of contract as set out by Mr Barn鈥攕o that risk sharing is used, should have been given back in 2021, at the latest. Why have we not made more progress more quickly? Mr Barn referred to glacial progress. Is he right about that as well?

Citizen Participation and Public Petitions Committee

Continued Petitions

Meeting date: 14 June 2023

Fergus Ewing

Okay. I want to put to you a point that Mr Barn made. Four of the sections have made orders. In two sections, the made orders were made well over a year ago; the other two were made more recently but still some time ago. Mr Barn said that, as soon as things reach that point, the contracts are ready to go. People are ready to press the button and ready to go into procurement, provided that the Scottish Government provides the money. Did you ask the Scottish Government to provide the money for each of those sections as soon as they reached made orders? If so, what was the response?

Citizen Participation and Public Petitions Committee

Continued Petitions

Meeting date: 14 June 2023

Fergus Ewing

That鈥檚 what they all say. [Laughter.]

Citizen Participation and Public Petitions Committee

Continued Petitions

Meeting date: 14 June 2023

Fergus Ewing

Is there a risk that the retender of the Tomatin to Moy section will lead to an even higher price, as we heard Mr Barn elucidate? Can you answer his point and recommendation that, although one must treat all parties equally in a tender process鈥攖hat is a plain and clear legal requirement of procurement鈥攖hat does not prevent you from reaching out to all the contractors to inquire about their progress, provided that they are asked the same questions, in order to be able to ascertain whether it is likely that you will end up in the same situation again, with one bidder only, but this time with an even higher price than the price that was previously rejected because it was deemed to be too high?

12:00  

Citizen Participation and Public Petitions Committee

Continued Petitions

Meeting date: 14 June 2023

Fergus Ewing

Are you saying that you have not been held back by the lack of funding from the Scottish Government? I have been critical of my own Government because the delays cannot be justified or defended in any way. It is disgraceful. I am sad to say that, but that is what I have said.

We want to know to what extent the Scottish Government has had the money ready but you have not got the process ready. We also want to know to what extent you have asked for money but you have not got yes as an answer. We need to know that for our inquiry. Moreover, to be frank, the public have a right to know.

Citizen Participation and Public Petitions Committee

Continued Petitions

Meeting date: 14 June 2023

Fergus Ewing

Good morning, Lord Advocate. I absolutely understand your central point that the concerns that other colleagues have expressed this morning are not matters for which you, as Lord Advocate, have legal responsibility. I understand that.

We are here because not only did the petitioners lose a child, that horrific experience for any parent was compounded, as Monica Lennon has eloquently said on previous occasions, by what happened afterwards. Therefore, my question to you is really about the role of Lord Advocate in Scotland. After all, you are leading the system of criminal prosecutions and the investigations of death. Is there not a statable argument that, although there are certain specific legal responsibilities, which you have clearly set out and are clearly delineated, there is perhaps a higher obligation? If not the Lord Advocate, who can deal with this? It seems to me that the professional bodies will patently not really be able to do this.

Lord Advocate, is it not the case that some people might see your role not so much as one of an umpire or a referee but as one of a team manager? If something really goes wrong, some kind of action would be expected of the Lord Advocate in order to initiate action, if not by yourself, because you lack the legal power and competence to do so, by urging others to do so, whether that be the Scottish Government, the royal colleges or otherwise.

Our job is to speak for the petitioner鈥攖hat is why we are here; it is, as the convener has said, nothing to do with politics鈥攕o, in that respect, is there not a statable argument that some people see your role in a much wider sense than you appear to have set out to us today? If there is merit in that argument, is it worth reflecting on whether there is any way in which your esteemed and distinguished office, which is so important to the dispatch of justice in Scotland, can take action to deal with the horrendous grievance that the petitioner in this case has suffered?

Citizen Participation and Public Petitions Committee

Continued Petitions

Meeting date: 14 June 2023

Fergus Ewing

I apologise to Mr Torrance for stealing his thunder, but I think that that is worth while, out of justice to the petitioner, because we do not really have a clear answer. We should at least get an answer to that.

Citizen Participation and Public Petitions Committee

Continued Petitions

Meeting date: 14 June 2023

Fergus Ewing

The profit margin in the contracts is 2 per cent. Is that standard?

Citizen Participation and Public Petitions Committee

Continued Petitions

Meeting date: 14 June 2023

Fergus Ewing

A framework contract could involve several companies, perhaps mostly from Scotland, sharing the work to complete the A9. It would be possible to put the section of the A96 from Smithton to Auldearn, which is also a Government commitment not affected by the Bute house agreement, into that framework. That might have the benefit of limiting the disruption, or spreading it out across the road network, rather than risking the closure of the A9 to Inverness, which is an unattractive prospect for many of my constituents. Would it be possible to put that into the framework contract?

Citizen Participation and Public Petitions Committee

Continued Petitions

Meeting date: 14 June 2023

Fergus Ewing

I am sure that they will wait with due patience.