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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 26 December 2025
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Displaying 2087 contributions

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Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 2 October 2025

Martin Whitfield

Thank you. Graham?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 2 October 2025

Martin Whitfield

By way of clarification, the purpose of the statutory instruments is not to remove someone from being a councillor or an MP or being in the House of Lords; it would prevent an individual sitting as an MSP if those other consequences existed outside of those periods. It is not about this place ordering someone to step down as a councillor and saying, “Should you choose not to, the consequence will be that you cannot be an MSP.” Is that correct?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 2 October 2025

Martin Whitfield

The committee will report on the outcome of the decisions on the SSIs in due course. Are members content to delegate the authority to approve the draft report to the convener?

Members indicated agreement.

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 2 October 2025

Martin Whitfield

That is excellent. Thank you. Sue Webber, would you like to start the questions?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 2 October 2025

Martin Whitfield

There is no deduction in relation to members of the House of Lords because, as you say in the policy document, they do not receive a salary; they receive an attendance allowance. What consideration was given to that, perhaps drawing on the consultation, and why was it not considered appropriate to treat the attendance allowance in the same way as the salaries for councillors and MPs?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 2 October 2025

Martin Whitfield

Yes. I go back to the fundamental reasons for seeking to end dual mandates, namely that it is rightly considered that roles such as councillor, MP and MSP are full-time jobs and that we expect the individuals who fulfil those roles to give them their full-time commitment. The discussions that we have had about the financial side relate to the practical implementation of one of the consequences, whereby individuals benefit—I use the word “benefit”, although I doubt that any of them feel that it is a benefit in this sense—from receiving, in effect, two salaries for a period of time. That is the policy decision in relation to what we are trying to achieve today, is it not?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 2 October 2025

Martin Whitfield

Who will take responsibility for the monitoring?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 18 September 2025

Martin Whitfield

Good. My other question, which is about the equality impact assessment, is twofold. First, why did it take so long to produce, given the content of the order? Secondly, why was it published so late?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 18 September 2025

Martin Whitfield

Absolutely. It is a question of allowing adequate and proper scrutiny to take place. The equality impact assessment was published on 16 September. I absolutely accept the difficulties and aim no criticism at all at any of those who support the minister on the matter, but there are timetables for when such things should be provided. Those timetables were established because they give enough time for adequate and proper consideration.

The one element that concerns me about the impact assessment’s contents relates to an issue that you have acknowledged—the subjective challenge of conducting impact assessments with young people and the way in which that is achieved. The process of the order is one thing, but, on a slightly wider scale, with regard to the work that was done on the bill that is now the Scottish Elections (Representation and Reform) Act 2025, and on the other legislation, are you any the wiser about how to reach out to young people and to measure the impact on them, rather than engaging only with those who feel that they speak for them—in fact, some do speak for them—and others who say that the subjective evidence is, “There’s no problem here. It must be good because we say it’s good”?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 18 September 2025

Martin Whitfield

What concerns me is that, despite the incorporation of the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child here and the very strong foundational requirement for human rights, the impact assessment for the order states:

“Officials are largely reliant on anecdotal evidence from electoral administrators.”

If we look at those coming out of care, we are talking about, first of all, a relatively small group, but also a group that contains some of the most vulnerable individuals.

I suppose that my question is: are you genuinely content that you have come to an understanding of their needs and expectations? I absolutely accept that a single person’s input was invaluable in occasioning this particular change, and I echo your thanks to them and your hopes that that provides good evidence that individuals can change policy, but are you content that you have captured the expectations and needs of this group in particular, given the evidence that we have heard about the geographical challenge that it brings?