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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 24 August 2025
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Displaying 893 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802”

Meeting date: 8 September 2022

Craig Hoy

Good morning, Mr Middleton. I want to look deeper into the issue of the builders refund guarantee and Jim McColl’s account of the discussions that he undertook with—he said—the Scottish Government and CMAL in developing a bid, in which, he says, you knew that they were not in a position to offer a builders refund guarantee. That is documented in an exchange of letters between Stuart McMillan and Derek Mackay in February 2015, in which it is intimated that it would be possible to proceed without a full builders refund guarantee. What was your awareness of that correspondence?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802”

Meeting date: 8 September 2022

Craig Hoy

The letter of February 2015 has not been formally released to the committee, but it has been quoted in the press. Among the reports of that, Mr Mackay gives reassurance to Mr McMillan that it would be possible to proceed without a builders refund guarantee. Mr Mackay says that CMAL had, on occasion, “taken different approaches”. Are you aware of any “different approaches” in relation to that fundamental issue of a builders refund guarantee regarding any prior procurements?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802”

Meeting date: 8 September 2022

Craig Hoy

The culture of Government appears to be quite tight, so it would be safe to assume that there were channels of communication.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802”

Meeting date: 8 September 2022

Craig Hoy

Obviously, you were not there for the unveiling of preferred bidder status. However, it was said that you would take the lead on that announcement. Subsequently, something changed. Would it have been the First Minister’s office’s decision to press for that to be announced at a high-profile photo-shoot style event rather than, as Mr Middleton said, through the issuing of the usual contractual letters?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802”

Meeting date: 8 September 2022

Craig Hoy

Are you a bit concerned that you were not there for the awarding of preferred bidder status but that everything seems to have hung on that decision and that there is a sense that, in effect, what happened afterwards was almost a fait accompli? With regard to the position of the Scottish Government and the First Minister, given that these documents have come to light, are you concerned that you are being lined up to be the fall guy—that this is operation blame Derek Mackay?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802”

Meeting date: 8 September 2022

Craig Hoy

Mr Mackay, you said that all options on nationalisation had been exhausted, but I challenge that. Jim McColl said that he put to you a Queen’s counsel’s report that showed that a financial restructuring would have meant that he, FMEL and the Government would have split any future risk, potentially saving the taxpayer £100 million. He says that he gave you that report and that you either ignored it or dismissed it without taking legal advice. Is that correct?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802”

Meeting date: 8 September 2022

Craig Hoy

Are you certain of that?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802”

Meeting date: 8 September 2022

Craig Hoy

Prior to your going on annual leave, did you get the impression that the preferred bidder status would likely be awarded to FMEL, and that that was the direction of travel? Were you comfortable with that?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “New vessels for the Clyde and Hebrides: Arrangements to deliver vessels 801 and 802”

Meeting date: 8 September 2022

Craig Hoy

This was not just issuing letters; this was “Lights, camera, action!” with the First Minister. Given that you had not got there yet and there was still the unresolved issue with the builders refund guarantee, did you have any concern that you were going to compromise further negotiations?