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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 22 June 2025
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Displaying 1574 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Michael Marra

Is there anything else in the evidence that we have received that you will take on board when you are trying to revise the financial memorandum?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Michael Marra

So you are not given any standard ways of presenting financial memorandums. As colleagues have picked up, we are looking at wildly different ways of presenting what should be the same thing. The convener has pointed out that we cannot be in the position of comparing apples and pears. We have a little disagreement between Mr Mason and the convener about how the figures are presented and whether they are material or immaterial, but is there no standardised process that you are presented with to say how you should present the figures?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Financial Memorandum

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Michael Marra

So you did not adhere to the standardised process.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scottish Fiscal Commission (Report on Climate Change and Fiscal Sustainability)

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Michael Marra

So, there is a cost to acceleration. That is very useful.

As a broader question, how does this work map on to the SFC鈥檚 other work? The commission has set out the long-term fiscal scenarios for Scotland, but Professor Roy said that he has learned a lot from this process, too. Can we expect very substantial updates with regard to the longer-term challenges in the next iteration of your 2050 vision?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Michael Marra

That takes me on to section 56, in part 2 of the bill, which is on the power to offset credits and debits. We have received some evidence on that section, which we have touched on briefly today.

The Institute of Chartered Accountants of Scotland and the Law Society of Scotland both have concerns about the lack of safeguards for a situation in which there is a dispute between the taxpayer and Revenue Scotland about whether an amount of tax is outstanding. Revenue Scotland has confirmed in writing and in oral evidence that that power would be used only when there is no dispute regarding the amount payable. However, that approach is not explicitly set out in the bill, so there is still concern from those who are charged with operating the system on behalf of clients. Does the Scottish Government intend to amend the bill at stage 2 to make that explicit?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Michael Marra

My recollection is that that was recognised in the evidence. I would say that the set-off power was well established and reasonable, given the requirement that there is no dispute, which we have already covered.

Revenue Scotland is an organisation that currently runs two taxes and is about to run a third, if Parliament agrees to that. Is it not disproportionate鈥攁t this moment in time, in particular鈥攖o bring in a fairly wide-ranging power across those areas, given the caveats that I have talked about? We are putting this power in primary legislation. Is there a good reason for that? Should we not be looking at the matter more in the round, as Liz Smith suggested, in terms of a broader issue around tax?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Michael Marra

It just feels a little bit like it is something on a shopping list鈥攊t is about wanting parity with HMRC over what is a very limited number of taxes. That does not feel to me to be very sensible.

As part of that, I will come on to section 55, which is about automation. We received concerns from the Chartered Institute of Taxation, which made a specific comparison to the Horizon scandal. Obviously, that attracted the attention of the committee, and rightly so. Does the minister want to make comments on that area?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Michael Marra

In earlier answers to the convener, minister, you were keen to draw the distinction between the rate of tax and its administration. One of the bill鈥檚 policy intents is to support the Scottish Government鈥檚 circular economy objectives, but is it not the case that, in the legislation as set out, the only mechanism for pursuing that is the rate itself?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Michael Marra

I do not disagree but my issue on that point is that it is less about the specific operation of the regulation as it applies to different tax rates and more about the fact that we can interrogate this only on the level of principle with regard to how these things might be appropriate, where the human checks and balances are in the systems and what would happen if we did not do that comprehensively. However, I am probably ranging off topic.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Michael Marra

The committee has taken a bit of an interest in this area, and we have been addressed by different experts about it. I wonder whether it feels a bit like the piecemeal approach that people are warning against and whether it would be better to have an all-governing AI approach strategy around publication of algorithms, the way in which AI will be applied in different areas and how those things are tested so that the Government takes a more proactive overarching approach, which might be done through legislation, in order to govern the operation of public service in this area.

I suppose that I am just asking for reflections, minister. It is not a criticism necessarily.