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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 17 June 2025
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Displaying 1574 contributions

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Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]

Session 6 Priorities

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Michael Marra

You will understand that, when the chief executive of an organisation—the person who leads that organisation—welcomes the announcement that the organisation is to be folded, the hundreds of staff who work for that individual and who she is charged with leading would be incredibly disappointed. Dr Robertson’s welcome for your announcement is a dereliction of leadership, in fact. Staff have made it clear that they want separate representation on that body—they do not have faith in the leadership of the SQA to represent their expert opinions and experience. I hope that you might consider that and write again to the trade unions on that basis.

If I could move to my last question—

Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]

Session 6 Priorities

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Michael Marra

That is superb. My last point is on a separate issue. A significant theme emerged from the evidence that the committee took and the conversations that we had with pupils across Scotland. They have all been very concerned about qualifications, as we have all been, but the challenge relates to what they have learned over the past two years. They have had a huge amount of time out of school. Have you and your officials assessed the knowledge and learning gaps and the impact of those? Has that informed your recovery plan?

Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]

Session 6 Priorities

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Michael Marra

That is critical. The document that you published yesterday does not contain any data about that loss. It talks about the equalities audit that took place in January. Everyone in Parliament and in the country would want to see a response that is based on what has happened. What has been lost? How much time has been lost? It does not seem to me that you have a full grasp of what that is. It is great that some measures might be forthcoming, but those must be in response to what has happened. I worry that the Government has not grasped the scale of the challenge.

Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]

Session 6 Priorities

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Michael Marra

You just do not know how much.

Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]

Session 6 Priorities

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Michael Marra

I am animated by the issue of digital skills, which pertains to my home city of Dundee and more broadly across the country. I am not convinced by the cabinet secretary’s analysis. We have a situation where companies offering computer games training or universities providing computing courses cannot make it compulsory for applicants to have passed higher computing, because there are not enough teachers to enable our kids to pass those highers.

It is reasonable for the convener to say that there is an issue with SDS, but there is more in the cabinet secretary’s portfolio that pertains to the issue of training. Those are not low-paid jobs; they are well paid. They are the jobs of the future and could be attracting investment.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Alternative Certification Model

Meeting date: 29 September 2021

Michael Marra

There was significant upset among staff. I have spoken with trade unions, which have said that staff were upset by the announcement and the way that it was welcomed by the organisation’s leadership. Is it fair to say that?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Alternative Certification Model

Meeting date: 29 September 2021

Michael Marra

I appreciate that.

Given some of the previous questioning, I am a little worried about the distance from Government and the extent to which some of the advice and expertise that can be drawn on—which, as you rightly reflect, is so important to the education system—is independent.

I want to look forward a little to next year, if I can, to pull everything together with regard to the plans that you have set out. In my view, the guidance that was issued on 15 September was lacking detail and clarity. I recognise the context in which everyone is operating, but young people and teachers need clarity. That has come through very strongly in the evidence that we have heard from young people—there was a complete lack of clarity last year and even less the year before, so we are looking for more clarity this year.

In particular, the guidance sets out that, if mitigations to exams are needed, those decisions will be left until March next year. It does not set out any detail on what criteria those decisions will be made on, so any comment on that would be useful.

In addition, it does not say whether decisions will be made pupil by pupil, school by school, council by council or Scotland wide. At what level will the approach be decided? Will disruption be experienced differently by pupils? We need more clarity on that, so it would be helpful if you could give us some comment and provide clarity for those young people.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Alternative Certification Model

Meeting date: 29 September 2021

Michael Marra

Thank you for that clarification.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Alternative Certification Model

Meeting date: 29 September 2021

Michael Marra

I am interested in some of the questions about form and function, as you have put it. We all know about the very important job that the SQA has to do over the coming year, and the pandemic challenges remain vast for the education system.

Fiona Robertson, on 21 June, you issued a statement that welcomed the announcement that your organisation was going to be scrapped. Did you consult the SQA’s staff before you issued that statement?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Alternative Certification Model

Meeting date: 29 September 2021

Michael Marra

But it increased this year, under this model.