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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 8 August 2025
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Displaying 885 contributions

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Education, Children and Young People Committee

Covid-19 and Schools

Meeting date: 19 January 2022

Kaukab Stewart

Thanks for that, Greg. The message that I am getting is that the guidance and the responses of staff, including leaders, are becoming more sophisticated. I have to say that those leaders have done an awesome job. Headteachers are promoted to be heads of teaching, and now they are having to deal with scientific evidence, health and safety and all the rest of it. So, hats off to all school leaders at every level.

I am getting that the advice is coming through and it is more responsive, but there needs to be more consistency across all authorities in Scotland. Is that correct?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Covid-19 and Schools

Meeting date: 19 January 2022

Kaukab Stewart

As you will know, I worked as a teacher for many years, so I know that buildings vary. We have everything from Victorian buildings with huge windows to more modern buildings that have internal ventilation systems. I am aware that the issue is complex, and it is clear that catering for all those different needs requires local flexibility across authorities. I wondered whether any areas of the country had raised more concerns than others, but I think that you have addressed that.

I ask Margaret Wilson for a view from parents. We have heard a few voices regarding children freezing in classrooms and the fact that opening a window is not a simple solution, especially given the Scottish weather, as it can get very cold. Have you been hearing any major concerns about the effects of temperature on children from a parent鈥檚 point of view? I am also thinking about people having to wear outdoor clothing inside.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Covid-19 and Schools

Meeting date: 19 January 2022

Kaukab Stewart

I want to take us back to ventilation, which Ross Greer touched on, in order to drill down and get underneath the headlines that there have been. First, I put on record that, as an ex-teacher, I am really grateful to my colleagues in the profession and to all staff, parents and pupils who had to turn on a sixpence. The amount of work that has been done is amazing. That applies to councils across Scotland, as well.

I want to ask about the assessments that have been done with regard to ventilation. The COSLA report says that 100 per cent of the learning and teaching spaces were assessed by November 2021, yet we have been hearing evidence from voices both within and outwith the profession that there are inadequacies. I would like some more information about that assessment of all the learning and teaching places. What mitigations were made, how were any issues rectified and where are we in that process? How much more is there to be done? I direct my question to Simon Cameron from COSLA initially.

10:30  

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Covid-19 and Schools

Meeting date: 19 January 2022

Kaukab Stewart

Thank you, Simon.

I welcome Douglas Hutchison to his new post in Glasgow. It is day 3, and you are in front of the Education, Children and Young People Committee. I thank you for your contributions so far.

Can you indicate any concerns that ADES has heard across Scotland regarding ventilation? I am referring to not only the use of HEPA鈥攈igh-efficiency particulate air鈥攆ilters and CO2 monitors but the ability to open windows and doors for natural ventilation. What is ADES鈥檚 view on that?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Covid-19 and Schools

Meeting date: 19 January 2022

Kaukab Stewart

Thank you, Margaret. It is important to hear those views.

I have a question for Greg Dempster. The school estate is huge, but it is important for us to remember that it then drills down into small workplaces. In that sense, it is quite a fragmented estate. I think that it is important to acknowledge the additional stresses and strains on school leaders. Can Greg give us any insight from a headteacher and depute point of view? Has he heard from his members any concerns about ventilation or whether the communication between them and their support services is effective? Have any concerns that they have raised been dealt with? If not, is there anything that we can do better in that area?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Covid-19 and Schools

Meeting date: 19 January 2022

Kaukab Stewart

It is important to get a strong message out to staff, pupils, parents and all stakeholders that, if they have concerns about ventilation in their environments, there is a clear and available route that they can pursue to get those issues addressed, that those channels are open and that there should be no fear of judgment or repercussions.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Budget 2022-23

Meeting date: 12 January 2022

Kaukab Stewart

I take your point about the fact that ring-fenced money allows a specific route to ensure the delivery of Government policy. However, we are all aware that the needs and priorities of local authorities can vary across the country. Several questions have been put to me about the consistency of delivery across all local authorities. Is there a role鈥擨 imagine that there is a pretty strong one鈥攆or the Government in ensuring consistency across all local authorities in Scotland? What is that role, and has any work been done on monitoring and assessing the consistency of delivery?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Budget 2022-23

Meeting date: 12 January 2022

Kaukab Stewart

Bob Doris has a brief supplementary question.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Budget 2022-23

Meeting date: 12 January 2022

Kaukab Stewart

While you were offline, I was able to ask my questions on teacher recruitment and numbers, so, if it is okay with everyone, I will move on to my line of questioning.

I can pick up on the previous thread quite nicely. Policy agendas, commitments and priorities are set at a Government level, but the responsibility for delivering those obviously lies at a local government level. In relation to local government responsibilities, there is a balance to be considered between having ring-fenced money for specifics and having discretionary funding. I would like to explore the strengths and weaknesses of each distribution method. How has the Government assessed the strengths and weaknesses of providing ring-fenced money and of providing discretionary funding?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Budget 2022-23

Meeting date: 12 January 2022

Kaukab Stewart

In the absence of the convener, I will take over as deputy convener. Good morning, cabinet secretary. Please continue with your answer.