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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 28 August 2025
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Displaying 3543 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland鈥檚 Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

I would be interested if you could expand on that. Will you give an example of the sort of activity that staff would normally support and assist with, which is now challenging, if not impossible, for them to deliver?

Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland鈥檚 Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

Under agenda item 2, which is our main item of business today, we will consider the proposals for an early release of prisoners and other key challenges in Scotland鈥檚 prisons. This is a preparatory session for next week鈥檚 appearance at the committee by the Cabinet Secretary for Justice and Home Affairs and the Scottish Prison Service.

I welcome our first panel of witnesses to the meeting. They are Professor Sarah Armstrong, who is professor of criminology at the University of Glasgow; Kate Wallace, who is chief executive officer of Victim Support Scotland; and Lynsey Smith, who is chair of the justice standing committee at Social Work Scotland. I thank you all for agreeing to provide evidence to the committee.

I refer members to paper 1. I thank Families Outside and the Howard League Scotland for their written submissions, which have been very helpful.

I intend to allow around 60 minutes for the evidence session. I will begin with a general opening question for our panel members. I will start from the left, bringing in Professor Armstrong first, and then work across the panel.

As you know, the cabinet secretary proposes that we release up to 550 prisoners earlier than anticipated, because of an emergency situation. She is proposing other measures for later on, via new primary legislation, to cover long-term prisoners. In general terms, what are your views on the proposals? Will they be enough, or should an alternative way forward be found, particularly for the longer-term approach?

Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland鈥檚 Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

Thank you for coming.

Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland鈥檚 Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

I will stick with Ian Bryce for a moment. Earlier, you spoke about blockages of older prisoners, and access鈥擨 wrote this down鈥攖o some of the offence-focused work that they are required to undertake. That work is important for the Parole Board in terms of your ability to assess risk.

What are the pinchpoints there? Can you expand a wee bit more on that? Is it just as simple as the pressures of the prison population, or is there a wee bit more to it?

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 29 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

On the complaints process, the committee heard evidence from a number of witnesses that, although they feel that the bill鈥檚 provisions are fine in themselves, they would like to see a more radical overhaul of the complaints process so that it is as independent as possible. Does the bill go far enough to meet those aspirations, particularly the aspirations of members of the public and former officers who have had experience of the complaints system and have indicated that an independent process would be more transparent and effective?

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 29 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

Last week, HMICS picked up on the point that you made about the inclusion of former officers in the PIRC. It highlighted the balance between independence and staff in the PIRC having the skill set to run complex investigations involving things such as mobile telephony and data. It seems to be about getting that balance right.

I will open up the questions to members.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 29 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

In its evidence, the Scottish Police Authority expressed support for the provision that relates to calling in complaints being a function of the PIRC. It felt that that was a positive step forward. I am interested in the backdrop to the inclusion of that provision.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 29 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

As I said, the SPA was broadly supportive of that provision. The committee also heard other evidence that that provision would enhance the investigation process.

The bill places an individual duty of candour on police officers only, although staff would be covered by a separate organisational duty of candour, achieved by amending the policing principles. Should that individual duty also apply to all police staff or at least to those with the same powers and responsibilities as police officers, such as custody staff, who have a particular role? They are not police officers鈥攖hey are staff鈥攂ut they have a type of role about which there is the potential for complaints to be made. That is the view of the PIRC, Police Scotland and HMICS, although that is opposed by Unison. I am interested in your response to that.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 29 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

I am sorry, Ms Dowey, but I need to bring in other members.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 29 May 2024

Audrey Nicoll

Three members still want to come in. We have 15 minutes or so left, so I ask for succinct questions and responses.