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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 18 August 2025
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Displaying 3543 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee

Decision on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 15 January 2025

Audrey Nicoll

Good morning, and welcome to the second meeting in 2025 of the Criminal Justice Committee. We have received no apologies from members. Fulton MacGregor joins us online.

The first item of business is a decision on whether to take item 3 in private. Do we agree to take that item in private?

Members indicated agreement.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police Investigations and Review Commissioner Annual Report 2023-24

Meeting date: 15 January 2025

Audrey Nicoll

The next item of business is to hear from the Police Investigations and Review Commissioner team on its work in the past year and its plans for the future. I am pleased to welcome to the committee Michelle Macleod, the commissioner; Sharon Smit, the accountable officer; and Phil Chapman, the director of operations. I refer members to papers 1 and 2. I intend to allow about 60 minutes for the session.

Before we move to questions, I ask the commissioner to make a short opening statement to highlight the main points from the annual report.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police Investigations and Review Commissioner Annual Report 2023-24

Meeting date: 15 January 2025

Audrey Nicoll

I will bring in Sharon Dowey in a moment, but I want to ask about the recruitment and retention information that is helpfully set out in your annual report. Of course, none of the work that you do could happen without the quality and experience of your staff body. I note that on page 31 of your report, you make reference to the fact that the budget is set each year by the Scottish Government, that you are under the same pressures with regard to things like public sector pay rises as other bodies are, and that you had to submit a business case to

“request additional funding for staff costs on a recurring basis and temporary funding for legal fees.â€

Although the report says that you have a low staff turnover, which is really good, it also says that there will be retirals in the coming year. Can you say more about your priorities with regard to retaining an experienced and skilled staff body under the constraints that you face?

Criminal Justice Committee

Police Investigations and Review Commissioner Annual Report 2023-24

Meeting date: 15 January 2025

Audrey Nicoll

We wish you well in whatever comes next for you. Thank you again for coming along today.

We move into private session.

11:09 Meeting continued in private until 11:55.  

Criminal Justice Committee

Police Investigations and Review Commissioner Annual Report 2023-24

Meeting date: 15 January 2025

Audrey Nicoll

I am sure that the benefits of body-worn video that you mentioned, and perhaps those of other digital transformation aspects, will come up in members’ questions.

That brings me on to looking forward. During our scrutiny of the Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill, we discussed the PIRC’s capacity, and we took evidence from you on that. What capacity and resourcing factors for the PIRC need to be considered for next year and beyond?

Criminal Justice Committee

Policing Vulnerable People

Meeting date: 8 January 2025

Audrey Nicoll

If you want to provide a follow-up answer in writing, that would be helpful.

Criminal Justice Committee

Policing Vulnerable People

Meeting date: 8 January 2025

Audrey Nicoll

Thank you—we managed to get that question in.

I am looking through the door and I do not think that the cabinet secretary is outside yet, so I will shamelessly insert a final question. [Laughter.] It is on a point that is made in the Social Work Scotland submission on the basic issue of the police being able to make contact with services. I direct this question to David Hamilton—you may need to take it away, David. Do police officers have available to them the core access that local arrangements should be supporting?

Criminal Justice Committee

Policing Vulnerable People

Meeting date: 8 January 2025

Audrey Nicoll

Okay—great. That is the final word. I thank you all for what has been an excellent session. We could probably have run on for another hour.

We will have a short suspension to allow a changeover of witnesses.

11:27 Meeting suspended.  

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Criminal Justice Committee

Policing Vulnerable People

Meeting date: 8 January 2025

Audrey Nicoll

One of the things that was highlighted in the paper on safe spaces was the need for peer support, which the cabinet secretary referred to, as well as the need to work alongside clinical staff. The clinical aspect of overall care is important.

Criminal Justice Committee

Policing Vulnerable People

Meeting date: 8 January 2025

Audrey Nicoll

That is helpful to know.

I will stop there and bring in members, starting with Liam Kerr.