˿

Skip to main content
Loading…

Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

Filter your results Hide all filters

Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 18 August 2025
Select which types of business to include


Select level of detail in results

Displaying 1231 contributions

|

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

The UNCRC defines a child as under 18. As I said in my opening remarks, that has cross-party support. Sixteen and 17-year-olds are still children and have the best chance of being rehabilitated.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

There are inconsistencies.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

I do not believe that a blanket definition of 16 for all the different things that you discuss is appropriate.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

I do not like to speak in hypothetical terms. We have said that it will be possible.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

The proposal has been worked through and discussed. The process is on-going, so, if we see that there will be issues with capacity, the Scottish Government will absolutely—

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

As I said, we will continue to monitor the situation. I do not rule anything out. On your point, we are committed to funding the interventions for vulnerable youth service, which is hosted by Kibble, as you might be aware. IVY is a specialist psychological and social work service that provides three types of service: professional consultation and advice, psychological assessment and psychological intervention for children who are at risk of harming others. Such support can be given to those on the edge of secure care and to those in secure care settings. We are committed to that service.

As I said, I do not rule anything out as we go forward.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

Secure care would be very much a last resort as an alternative to police custody. I would have to hand over to my officials to give the costings.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

As I have said, the financial memo sets out the headline costs and was produced following in-depth engagement with partners and duty bearers. Given the nature of care and justice services, there is a high degree of variability.

As I have mentioned to other members, it is important to recognise the wider backdrop of the benefits that the change programmes could have to society. The negative economic and social costs to society of offending and crime are well documented. For example, the “Follow the Money” report, which is associated with the Promise, estimates that the cumulative private costs of crime, physical and emotional harm and lost output, as well as public service costs, are upwards of £3.9 billion. A huge amount of money is being spent in that regard. Although the costs in the financial memorandum look large, if you balance them against that other sum, you can see that there is real potential there.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

Absolutely. As I mentioned earlier, each child’s care, even within a secure care centre, is dealt with on a case-by-case basis. It is defined by the child and the support that they need. Secure accommodation centres already utilise a range of interventions and strategies to meet the needs of all children, to ensure that their safety is maintained and that risk is managed. That is important in relation to the member’s comments about the most serious offences.

Risk assessment and risk management frameworks allow for decisions about the level of care, the supervision and the restrictions on a child to be bespoke, proportionate and tailored to the needs of that child—that is what I was referring to when I mentioned dealing with things on a case-by-case-basis. That is to ensure both their safety and the safety of others in the secure centre.

We have no plans to change that or to separate children who are placed in secure care on the basis of considerations such as their route into secure care, their age or the offence type. Yes, we will listen, and we will work with those who are involved, and we will continue to monitor the issue as we go forward.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Children (Care and Justice) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 3 May 2023

Natalie Don-Innes

We need to recognise the wider backdrop to the issue. Over time, there will be a saving for society and for public expenditure. As I said, the financial memorandum sets out the headline cost and was produced via in-depth engagement with partners and duty bearers. As my officials have pointed out, given the nature of care and justice services, there is a high degree of variability, so it can be difficult to forecast. The Scottish Government wanted to avoid underestimating in many areas, and obviously there are significant financial implications. As I said, it is important to recognise the wider backdrop of the benefits that the change programmes could have for our society and for public expenditure.

I think that you had another question tacked on to that.